Anyhow, thank you for dropping by and joining the discussion. Thanks also for the kind comments about this blog. Do come back again soon.

Cheers!

The thing with such expectations is that, you look at the impact, both to the subject and to the persons that subject is supposed to provide an example for.

If someone, I’d argue, were the sort to lead by (good) example, they’d be doing it already. If they’re the sort of people that don’t set good examples, and do it because it’s -expected- of them… well, I don’t have a lot of faith in what example someone like that, with insincere motives, would be able to set in the long run.

I don’t think there would be much benefit from such a thing.

On the other hand, there’s human nature. If I engage in a selfless act of any sort, I do it for two things, one, because I feel it’s a good thing to do, and consequently, two, it makes me feel good about myself.

There might be some that do it for attention or image, but that goes back to the other argument, and I’m not referring to those folks here.

But what I might be willing to do, wanting to do even, out of the goodness of my heart… I might not be willing to do if it were, instead of something that I wished to do, something that was demanded of me.

That might turn off, the idea of, ‘How dare you not contribute to this charity’, for example, turn off a lot of people, myself included.

Just a ramble.

And thank you, sir, for an excellent blog, without which… well, newbies like me would likely still be googling without much success.

The Raconteur’s last blog post..Re: The Raconteur Bible - What About the JWs?

Prominent bloggers who are in position of influence and making money off us at least have a responsibility to set an example don’t you think. I certainly think so.

Without standards in the world of literature or the arts where would that leave us?

It’s not a matter of shoving my values down another. Like you said, “ethics are a given”, or at least it should be.

Thanks for dropping by.

Coming as a complete outsider into this whole thing, which implies, naturally, that I really don’t know what I’m talking about, but which also implies that I have no bias towards one position or the other…

Ethics are a given. You can’t just regurgitate other people’s material without citations or references. I have no qualms quoting other people, but it’s never more than a citation, ie, if I’m going to quote their entire post as the content of my own, I’m going to just put up a link to their post if I think my readership (such as it is) would find it interesting.

What strikes me here though, is this notion that prominence (ill begotten or otherwise) implies a social responsibility to set a standard or to urge towards furthering some social cause or the other (in this case, blogging ethics).

I’ve always found the notion unsavory that if I happen to be successful or prominent, I owe society some say in how I behave, or what I should do.

I’d be willing to go so far as to say that people in prominence should not detract from society, and not encourage negatives as we define them…

But there’s no requirement that one must be a model citizen or that one must work towards positive change if one happens to be so gifted with prominence.

The Raconteur’s last blog post..Conquering Trackbacks: The Raconteur Victorious

Tica Macha (Teri)’s last blog post..Manuel Antonio National Park

I’ve come to expect this sort of thing every time I write on the subject of blog ethics. You think they would tire of it but they keep coming back for more. It’s also a reason why I have to moderate comments on this blog. I wish I didn’t have to but that is the reality I live with in the virtual world.

Most of my readers are timid folk and afraid to get involved and I sometimes feel like the lone voice crying in the wilderness. So I can’t tell you how much I appreciate your support Lee. Thanks.

Chris is friendly with the group that I wrote about and they have a history of only showing up when I write about the subject of blog ethics. He wrote another comment here that I had to delete because it was a personal attack against me which is against the TOS of this blog.

The pro-sploggers offer nothing of value to this community except only to make personal attacks against yours truly. I really don’t mind discussing the subject with anyone so long as it is kept civil. Frankly I’m fed up with them and from now on I will have to take a more heavy-handed approach.

So if I seem to have come across as being tough here I hope you understand and there is a long history of animosity over this subject.

The fact is my only beef with the pro-blogger crowd is the lack of ethics in their pursuit to make money. Certain leaders in the community have spawned a ton of sploggers out there and they never write about the subject of ethics. They have a responsibility to do so being in a position of influence, so every once in awhile I write a post to remind them until (hopefully) they will get it.

In the past I’ve tried using humor to get through their thick heads but nothing has worked. Business carries on as usual so perhaps a more direct approach is required.

I will continue to write about blog ethics no matter who it bothers and the hecklers will not silence me. My advice is if the subject really bothers them that much then perhaps they should start listening to their conscience instead of just the ring of the cash register.

It’s a subject that I’m passionate about and I think is necessary in the blog community. I’m not trying to mean, I’m just trying my best to clean up a very BIG problem.

Oh well, I thought you should know.

I wouldn’t mind so much if they would go their merry way and stay beneath the cracks where they belong, but unfortunately there are numerous copycat bloggers who are in direct competition with my blog niche and leading a lot of unwary people down the wrong path.

So I feel that I have no choice but speak out. It’s something I’m passionate about and it can be frustrating to see so many UN-professional bloggers perverting the term for their own greed.

Like I said before I have no problem with making money by blogging, BUT like anything else there is a right way and a wrong way to do it. The word “Professional” should be a high standard for people to strive for like it was intended, NOT just simply any means to making money.

A reasonable person can understand that.

Cheers!

Two blogs that I read regularly that are exceptions to the rule. Both are highly professional and both are apparently making a significant income from their blogs. But both are extremely entertaining. They are Confessions of a Pioneer Woman and Crabmommy. The world of problogging could learn a lot from these two women.

The argument over what defines a “professional” rages in almost every field of endeavor. The end result in most cases is that a profession will eventually institute a certification process to ensure that someone who calls themselves a professional this-or-that actually has the credentials to make that claim. I don’t see that happening in blogging for the obvious reasons. But there are a lot of folks out there making the claim of being professional that are anything but.

Take a good look at any definition you like and any reasonable person can see that making money is at best an incidental afterthought. Clearly you are speaking from a position of bias as a diehard friend of the pro-splog community, and no amount of reasoning can make you interested in a subject like ethics.

It’s been my experience that ethics always takes a backseat especially to those who are so driven to make money.

Neither do your examples have any merit or relevance to this discussion because if you read all my material you would know that I have no problem with advertisements so long as the blog content is of quality and original.

In fact it was you who boasted about not having ads on your blog, so perhaps you should be pointing the finger in your own direction. And the only amusement that I can see from all our conversations is that you obviously still don’t get it.

Regarding the full feeds issue that you bring up, you are obviously still subscribed to an old summary feed option that I once offered. I recommend that you update it immediately so you can read all of my content and fully understand where I’m coming from.

Nevertheless what we are supposed to be discussing here is the true definition of a “professional” blogger. That is all.

One last point. Although I appreciate you commenting please kindly keep your thoughts relevant to the topic. Please also keep in mind that personal attacks are not allowed on this blog which I think your comments are bordering on.

Not to worry though because I hear you loud and clear. In the blogosphere money talks and blog ethics walks.

Don’t I know it.

You just subscribe to an amusingly purist definition of blogger which runs something along the lines of “one who posts without ever running ads.”

By your standard Michael Jordan shouldn’t be considered a professional basketball player because he used his popularity on the court to make millions selling Nike’s. Nor should any NASCAR driver ever be considered a professional driver because they all have adds completely covering their cars & and even their driving jump suits.

Your standard simply doesn’t make real world sense.

Pulling up the straw man of sploggers is just an attempt to muddy the waters here and not on point. I don’t know anyone who defends that approach, least of all the very probloggers you so consistently deride.

I know because I follow those professional bloggers very closely. Of course they mostly publish full feeds, making it easy to keep up. And I don’t even see those ads you find so offensive from my feed reader.

Then again I might keep up with you better if you’d publish full feeds yourself.

Just a thought.

In fact the one who could be accused of cherry picking would be yourself because your interpretation is simplistic and out of context. The fact remains that no matter which source you look at all of the definitions state “pro” means a “Professional” or an “Expert” in a chosen field.

Of course a professional occupation expects to be paid, i.e. a Dr. or a Lawyer, but a professional who offers services pro-bono is still a professional regardless. And I resent your implication that I’m just a “hobbyist” blogger when in fact I probably fit the true definition of a “professional” more than most.

There’s a hell-of-a difference between legitimate business bloggers and sploggers. To accept your liberal interpretation would open the door to mean that every moronic splogger and spammer who wallpapers their blog with ads is a professional. I suppose you might also consider Kevin Trudeau of the late-night TV infomercial ilk to be a “professional” (as the Bloke rolls his eyes).

Hell, if anything goes then I guess I should just start selling my body (not that there would be any takers) or start a “professional” porn blog (with adsense of course).

Give me a break Chris. The fact remains that just making an income from blogging is NOT the point. Although a “professional” can make money, it is also about HOW you make the income (if you should happen to be making money from blogging).

BUT most importantly it is about your level of expertise. That is the true litmus test for a “professional” blogger. NOT if you just make an income from blogging.

With all due respect, your misguided attitude is exactly the problem because there are far too many Pro-Sploggers out there who have the same mentality and are ruining the blogosphere. Those friends that you mention are a big part of the problem because they are setting a bad example not stressing blog ethics and encouraging pro-sploggers to flourish out there.

Sorry Chris but that is completely NOT acceptable to this blogger.

As for you using your blog to leverage it into a full-time consulting business, I have no problem with that and in fact I applaud your efforts. I am bullishly pro-business-blogging so long as it is legitimate and perhaps you should read my blog(s) again because obviously you still don’t get my meaning.

I take great effort to explain my position in my posts and I’m surprised you still don’t get it. After all if I weren’t pro-business then why am I constantly being approached by respected business magazines to advertise (rhetorical question).

The bottom line is it’s the sleaze that I abhor. Blog Bloke will always be pro legitimate business. I hope that clarifies because frankly I’m weary of the so-called “pro-blogger” entourage twisting my words and accusing me of being anti-business. That’s utter nonsense and couldn’t be further from the truth.

Seems like you cherry picked non-income related definitions of the word. A quick look at dictionary.com’s listing for “professional” shows the first definition is

following an occupation as a means of livelihood or for gain

A professional is not simply an expert but one who is compensated for his expertise. Without that compensation a person is simply an expert hobbyist.

And that doesn’t say anything negative about the hobbyist’s knowledge. It could very well be more exhaustive than folks who are earning an income in the field.

I’ve leveraged my blog into a full time income. Yet you won’t see any adds there. Instead I sell my know how as a social media consultant to businesses that need help effectively entering this new era of two-way marketing communication.

I was able to build a full time business in part from the wealth of knowledge I gained for free from many of those same bloggers you so consistently deride. Yet they still have been compensated handsomely from the ads they run on their blogs.

It’s a system where everyone wins even though you don’t like it.

B.S. Loggers (Bait and Switch Bloggers)

or

M.S. Loggers (Money Scam Bloggers)